Puffwagon's Territory Adventures

[Puffwagon]

Haha nah that's my daughters little toy

[biddie_fiddler]

Found the user manual for this product out of interest to see how the system works. Very cool to see that they have rendered photos of the PCB of the controller. Main takeaway from this design though, its mostly analogue! There appears to be no "brains" behind the control system at all.

 

Designing a controller using a microcontroller is (generally) way more efficient so its odd to see they've stuck to potentiometers and gains to configure the device. Same goes for the header bridges and solder bridges.

 

I suppose they've kept with the KISS principle, however its not impossible to use this method too while implementing a MCU. I don't know the specs for the design though so maybe they decided a MCU wasn't a viable solution for the product 🤷‍♂️

 

Either way, very good looking bit of kit. PCB design is top notch, even if its a bit old school!  

Edited 05/11/21 01:05 AM by biddie_fiddler

[Puffwagon]

For how much it cost I hope it's as good as they say! I told the guy I wanted to use 98 octane to match my e85 figures, which are about 35psi and 950awhp, so that's what he specced it for and that's what I'll be aiming for when it's dialed in.

[biddie_fiddler]

Just had a quick browse on the thread, I don't think you mentioned the price of the setup?
Whats the hit on the wallet for the kit if you don't mind saying?

 

Interesting to see if the cost/performance is similar to just dedicated e85.

 

 

Also, if you're looking to match water/meth + 98 octane to your e85 results, what if you were to use water/meth + e85?? Would this further improve your power results?

[Puffwagon]

There was a bit of change from $2400. I got the direct port bundle too so you could get the system for about $1800 with pre tb injection.

 

You can get the same results as e85, and if you use e85 and water meth you get a tiny bit more so not really worth doing imo. Scroll down the page for barra results, https://www.instagram.com/cool_runnings_engineering_cre/

 

As far as cost vs performance goes, that will vary according to the user. I live in the sticks so there ain't much point running e85 all the time, when most of the driving is done at 100kph. The performance benefits get wasted for the most part. Also the local track sells e85 at $2/L and the nearest e85 servo is nearly 50km away, so it's not very cost efficient to buy it. Water meth is a good idea from my perspective, given those restrictions.

[Puffwagon]

Pulled the finger out cos there's only so many cat videos you can watch.

 

Got the head off and it's better than expected. No valves have hit but the intake cam journals are fairly galled.

 

Edit: the exhaust valves have touched but still look ok...will find out soon enough

 

New theory... Pump body exploded, lost oil pressure, cam galled, timing chain snapped, car said yeah nah bro.

 

Bottom end is looking alright. The usual nicks from broken porcelain but not enough to rebore it. Minor thrust wear but there's still hone marks so happy there.

 

So yerp, get the head fixed, r&r the bottom end for a clean etc and farken send it again!

 

Happy days 

Edited 05/11/21 07:43 AM by Puffwagon
Just cos

[bjc]

On 05/11/2021 at 10:09 AM, Puffwagon said:

Water meth system arrived today...should keep me busy for a while

 

You went the whole kit and caboodle! I thought you would have gone the flex fuel map blend and IMCC method with a wideband O2 or a simple progressive controller. Is there something extra that the Aquamist controller does or you just wanted to keep it as safe as possible with the extra redundancy? 

I've got a basic hobbs switch Snow Performance kit from a decade ago that's still waiting to be installed on the territory lol. It was on the ba turbo but didn't even get it running and then I wrote the car off... I'm unsure if I should buy a progressive controller or fully use PCMTec as even though I want port injection I think that dual nozzles will be enough for me as I need the IAT temp reduction along with the benefit of lower EGT's here in sh*tsville... 

 

Even though I'm in and out here like a teenager loosing his virginity, I'm sure we all want detailed instructions and data! 👍🏿

[bjc]

On 05/11/2021 at 11:30 AM, biddie_fiddler said:

Just had a quick browse on the thread, I don't think you mentioned the price of the setup?
Whats the hit on the wallet for the kit if you don't mind saying?

 

Interesting to see if the cost/performance is similar to just dedicated e85.

 

 

Also, if you're looking to match water/meth + 98 octane to your e85 results, what if you were to use water/meth + e85?? Would this further improve your power results?

The Tuning School on YouTube have done multiple tests on all fuels (except straight methanol only) pitting them against each other and also combining water/methanol. My takeaway with E85 would be 50/50 water/meth (as it won't burn the car down) and just inject it 14" away from TB and another behind the TB if needed to drop IAT and an octane boost if it makes it... 

I'm with Puffwagon wrt to the whole E85 and cruising around I know E85 has oxygen in it (unsure if it's the same from the pump but VP is like 30%+) and makes slightly more torque but 100% methanol only DP injection is the go imo it just has a bigger upfront cost which turns a lot of people away plus there aren't many tuners that still believe it works (you'd be surprised!). How can it make power with water in the combustion chamber is what every tuner apart from one years ago said to me.

Anyway... 

[Puffwagon]

There is a lot of sh*t you can get away with at lower power levels that you cant at 700kw. The direct port system will make sure that every cylinder is getting the right amount of water/meth.

 

I wouldn't trust an intake manifold to distribute the water/meth evenly at 35+psi. Sure it might, but until I see data that verifies it I'll play it safe. You can't run that much boost and E85 timing on 98, if you do it breaks sh*t, so I'm not willing to risk that with pre throttle body water/meth injection.

[bjc]

That's how blueboost (CPV Tuning now) ran 10's on 95oct back in 2005 and there was no failsafe back then with the basic snow kit as he mentions that if it failed to spray it ends quick lol.

Stathi at IMS before doing DP installs has a video with an FG and two jets pre TB doing over 500kw on 98oct with an "SBE" (lol) and I doubt he'd risk it for glory or maybe he does...that's my 2 cents though, video is on his YouTube channel. 

In your case with all the dollars in it I would have a few failsafes at play to but I doubt it'll ever be a pump or blocked jet unless the pumps are trash these days (doubt it), a dodgy relay or wire maybe is all I can think of but you have it all now so no worries.

I would have thought that you'd have a jet pre TB for cooling but the weather where you are is totally different though so maybe charge cooling isn't needed... 

I did notice here that when we had 25° days (18°C nights) that the IAT sat 5°C odd above ambient so it seems that post intercooler IAT in the heat here scale like degrees Kelvin!!! 

 

I'm keen to see your outcome either way.