Self tuning thoughts?

[molch]

Thanks fellas, heaps of great advice on both sides of the fence. I'll sleep on it tonight and make a decision tomorrow. I'm usually keen to learn which leads to more knowledge down the line and if needed greater appreciation to hand over my hard earned to the professionals.

[gaz097]

Just think about how everyone else learnt. I'd say 99% started as a mechanic as well.

1) do a course
2) watch someone else
3) self teach. ( internet has made this almost a viable option now)

Each work. Choose wisely.

[arronm]

I used to tune for a living.

 

A lot harder back then.

 

[turbotrana]

Hp Tuners is the way to go now. It can do everything you need it to do, brilliant datalogging.

 

Hook up a permanent wideband air/fuel ratio meter in the car with the bung in the downpipe. Hook up an external adjustable boost controller if you want to adjust boost , all ECU adjustments for this can be found on the forums. Boost controller simplifies the boost management side of it.

Use your existing tune and observation of the air fuel ratios on a good tune whilst driving will let you see where things should be.

 

If you find it too hard just get a good tuner who uses hp tuners to do any adjustments you are afraid of but make sure they leave the tune unlocked.

 

I have seen a few workshop tunes here in Perth and I scratch my head with their tuning style.   They specialise in big power but poor cold starts and drivability. At least if you have hp tuners you can let us have a look at the tune and we can collectively problem solve for you rather than with SCT you are in no mans land if you have a drivability problem and tuner who failed his year 10 leaving certificate.

 

Transmission tuning is quite easy to learn. We will have tunes shortly that you can copy from and you can input one parameter change at a time and observe effect. Good fun

[Ralph Wiggum]

1 hour ago, molch said:

Thanks fellas, heaps of great advice on both sides of the fence. I'll sleep on it tonight and make a decision tomorrow. I'm usually keen to learn which leads to more knowledge down the line and if needed greater appreciation to hand over my hard earned to the professionals.

 

 

Just remember the tuning interface is only part of the deal. You also need equipment to measure afrs and monitor knock. 

 

The gear will soon pay for itself if you continue mods and don't have to pay for retunes. 

 

Plus the day you stop learning you die. So keep learning. 

[molch]

2 minutes ago, Ralph Wiggum said:

Just remember the tuning interface is only part of the deal. You also need equipment to measure afrs and monitor knock. 

 

 

I have the afr side covered with the innovate lc2 but hadn't considered something to monitor knock. The subaru system I had experience tuning had decent knock sensors and would pull timing overall or even from specific loads and rpm's (fine learning knock correction tables) which with added logging could easily be spotted and timing adjusted before it was crazy detonation. 

 

I know any knock is bad so small adjustments and measurements is the best when working timing and fuel to get the best performance then dialing back for safety etc.

 

is this similar in the ford ecu?

[Puffwagon]

Fuel is easy as the wb will tell you what's up.

 

Knock ears or knock sensors will tell you where your timing can go but not necessarily where the best power is. A dyno will perfect this.

 

Getting the tune right for our cars pcm is more maths and understanding rather than knowing what a motor needs imho.

 

Disclaimer: I could be completely wrong and not know my head from my arse... 

Edited 21/09/16 01:34 PM by Puffwagon
make it releveant

[turbotrana]

Don't worry about knock too much. I've been running a tune for the last 6 months where all I did was scale the injectors properly and stopped the over boost cutout with an FG that has exhaust , intercooler ,injectors and pump. Not even touched timing or boost maps.

It hits 18psi + at times and datalogging timing, knock reveals the engine is very well protected by pulling the required timing.

 

You got to stuff up badly to wreck the engine through not enough fuel and / or wrong timing.

 

This is for FGs, I can't vouch for anything older.

Edited 22/09/16 05:24 AM by turbotrana

[Puffwagon]

I guess it's worth a mention that once knock starts timing has to be pulled further than if the motor was run at the correct timing to start with.

 

Example: Car wants 6 degrees. Car gets given 8 degrees and knocks. To stop the detonation, timing has to be pulled back to less than 6 degrees briefly. Bringing it back to 6 where it wouldn't have knocked is usually not enough to stop it knocking once it has started.

 

I'd prefer a linear timing log that goes 6-6-6-6-6-6 than one that goes 8-4-8-4-8-4-8-4.

 

All of those unheard "pings" will pit a piston crown over time and then its bye bye piston not to mention the hammering that the rod bearings take.

[turbotrana]

Yeh, ideally you want to get the timing where it does not activate knock as above. But the main point being is that there are failsafes built into the factory tune that work pretty good on the FG at least.

What I said above is running  98. Just run E85 and you will get full factory timing, no chance of hurting anything if fueling right, easiest tune.

Edited 23/09/16 05:40 AM by turbotrana