Pw Surge & 460 Pump With Stock Reg

[Bellato]

^ so mick if I just change fuel reg with the stage 1 fitting kit how much is involved in retuning? Can it just be touched up or is it like starting again? Just thinking its gonna cost over $500 fir fuel reg, install n retune so might have to leave as is for a little

[JETURBO]

What mick said

And fook that

Bellato u will be fine as the stage one still keeps 58psi/4bar base there ( wont allow extra ) like gilly mentioned 4.5bar is taking our base fuel press higher than the stock 4bar and then buggers with the speed density in the tune, but can allow higher flow from smaller injectors ( a backwards way of increasing flow for our situation )

Edited 06/08/13 11:12 PM by JETURBO

[Skids4kids]

  On 06/08/2013 at 10:58 PM, ratter said:

changing the fuels operating pressure means for the tune to be correct the complete speed density calculation needs to be redone, a lot more tuning time required unless an owner is willing to accept a near enough is good enough situation

100% agree.

[Skids4kids]

  On 06/08/2013 at 11:08 PM, JETURBO said:

What mick said

And fook that

Bellato u will be fine as the stage one still keeps 58psi/4bar base there ( wont allow extra ) like gilly mentioned 4.5bar is taking our base fuel press higher than the stock 4bar and then buggers with the speed density in the tune, but can allow higher flow from smaller injectors ( a backwards way of increasing flow for our situation )

Was mentioning it for different reasons but wont go into it and better options have been taken.

I didn't realise KPM did a higher flowing return 4.0BAR item so that would be a goer.

[ratter]

  On 06/08/2013 at 11:05 PM, Bellato said:

^ so mick if I just change fuel reg with the stage 1 fitting kit how much is involved in retuning? Can it just be touched up or is it like starting again? Just thinking its gonna cost over $500 fir fuel reg, install n retune so might have to leave as is for a little

if fuel pressure remains as tuned for then no tuning is required, if it changes pressure the rpm range that the pressure is different requires changes to the speed density equation, some people may be lazy and just rely on the closed loop fuel operation to rectify this if it's not major, but this is not ideal and results in some of the issues we keep seeing pop up from time to time and can make future diagnosis hard

[Bellato]

Okay thanks! Going to get them to log my pressures 2moro and looks like I'll probably need the stage 1 and will see what tuner says about retuning

[IH8TOADS]

I disagree. The speed density algorithm is for the airflow and Load calculation, in no way is it affected by fuel pressure.

What is affected is the injector scaling and all that is required is a simple adjustment to raise all values to their published 4.5 bar values. Fuel pressure affects injector flow rates so accounting for this in the tune (scaling) is all that is required.

I've done this before with the 4.5 bar drop in reg on a few cars.

[turbotrana]

This thread was making me explete prophanities till I got to yours Toads.

Edited 07/08/13 04:25 PM by turbotrana

[KPM Motorsport]

  On 07/08/2013 at 7:56 AM, IH8TOADS said:

I disagree. The speed density algorithm is for the airflow and Load calculation, in no way is it affected by fuel pressure.

What is affected is the injector scaling and all that is required is a simple adjustment to raise all values to their published 4.5 bar values. Fuel pressure affects injector flow rates so accounting for this in the tune (scaling) is all that is required.

I've done this before with the 4.5 bar drop in reg on a few cars.

Correct.

However the reason for running as close to standard fuel pressures is to capitislise on the full benifits and flow of the upgraded fuel system.

Minimal or no scaling changes is a secondary benifit. This way supplied accurate injector data can be utilised accurately for a given fuel system pressure.. eg our KPM scaling data is always generated for 4 bar standard pressure for the Aussie fords.

Edited 07/08/13 11:20 PM by KPM Motorsport

[IH8TOADS]

Quite a few people run big pumps and moderate boost and this makes a 4.5 bar regulator (such as those from 034motorsport with the oversize return) quite effective with a G302 52 lb/hr (GT500 injector). The six hole director plate, twin conical spray pattern and higher pressure result in decent fuel efficiency and quite high flow (~59 lb/hr). With this set-up the G302's were at 90% duty cycle at redline (6200rpm) in my BA being fed 16psi. I have no hesitation raising the bar (pun intended) when everything works in harmony!