E85

[turbotrana]

and again

You ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS run a colder plug on E85 then what you were with 91-93 octane or else you'll get pre-ignition. Stock DSM's typically run a BRP6ES plugs gapped to .026", modified on pump I recommend NGK BRP7ES plugs gapped to .028", and on E85 I recommend NGK BR8ES (No "P" in the part number) plugs gapped to .025".

E85 is highly resistant to knock but susceptible to whats called fuel pre-ignition, this is why you see tuners running E85 and melting pistons, valves, and spark plugs without ever seeing 1* of knock when it happens.

Quoted from NGK:

When using an ethanol blend fuel with high ethanol content in high performance applications, a colder heat range may be necessary. The spark timing can be advanced further because ethanol blend fuel has a higher resistance to knock (higher octane). Due to the decreased knock, there will be less audible “warning” from knock before the spark plug overheats and pre-ignites.

[JETURBO]

Good read and from what we have seen lines up also with what was said here but not so much on the turbo but on the s/c 5.0 responds like this

If fact richen it to even greater levels lambda 0.5 and the "torque feel" is amazing but becomes frequency noisy but not what u would say is knock, the rwkw suffered but the torque spread was greater and seat of the pants amazing even

On the 4.0 were allowing for leaner conditions to overcome mechanical limitations aren't we trana

But only after a point !

Before this point its tuner choice and you do see a wide variety of different afrs chosen typically 11.8/0.8 L

Having a play and data logging shows almost exactly what this cut n past has said ...

[turbotrana]

The above lifted posts were from 2010. Those yanky tuners are real giving aren't they Jet. No secrets with them and no talking in riddles hey.

[JETURBO]

And that's fine when u don't have to move heaven and earth to learn about a vehicle very few know about

Do u think I got an open book ?

Phuck me bought a bloody dyno to have a crack

Did night school, read Ebooks at a cost, paid for answers even,

And I give u a year 3 grade riddle and u have your knickers in a knot lol good work trana

[Ralph Wiggum]

Im idaho

[JETURBO]

A very sexy idaho at that

[turbotrana]

I never got an open book either. 20 years ago there was minimal info in book land (no internet), and all you had were performance car magazines that helped alot. You got it easy mate with what is out there now on the internet only.

Nevertheless if you want to keep info "close to your chest" as you put it cause you feel you worked hard for it then do that, but please don't do that thing where you put a small piece of info out there to tease the reader then let it be. You have done that to me several times. The first, second and third time I just scratched my head. Now I see a pattern of behaviour.

And yes mate, I am hopeless at solving riddles. But the stuff I posted up last night makes complete sense to me. Those guys could not have made it any clearer or have been more helpful. I expect reading between the lines for a woman but not a man so much.

[IH8TOADS]

But running a rich lambda for e85 lifts heads so the rumor says hahahaha

[turbotrana]

Further observations regarding cold start testing.

Cranking lambda. My car really only needs the cold crank lambda made very rich. 0.3 lambda was fine, 0.2 lambda is about the same and I put in 0.1 lambda for interest sake but the car wouldn't start at all for some reason. So a cold crank lambda of 0.3 works fine.

Cold start table I don't think you need to richen the cold start tables much. I have mine at 0.85 lambda in the lower temp areas and I think this works fine.

Closed loop delay. You need to increase the seconds it takes for the engine to go into closed loop, otherwise it goes into closed loop too quickly for the E85 to be able to idle the engine at 1 lambda.

I set mine to go into closed loop in the lower temps about 250 seconds and about 100 secs at 60 deg.

At the moment closed loop will trigger at anything from 10 to 30 seconds from cold start which can cause idle issues.

I think the short times put down in the closed loop delay tables are also responsible for the rough idle on Petrol in the morning

Edited 31/05/14 05:59 AM by turbotrana

[45T-XR]

Turbotrana,

Have you logged actual AFR whilst Cranking, and are you actually getting remotely close to it?

I still havent played around with my cold starts yet, but had the cranking lambda table to around .6 and was getting no where near that either. But it is obviously having an effect if it has cured your issue. We are having some cold mornings again here now, will be perfect opportunity to try fix mine. Great info from everyone.