The Ranga Is ...not on my xmas card list

[Impellor]

Well this is very interesting, but this tax is about revenue raising, carbon is the smoke screen.

People what we are seeing is a return to Keynesian economics. John Maynard Keynes developed an economic theory during the 1920's. When the depression struck in the 1930, s and seen many homeless and starving the potictical powers were concerned that revolution may result if this situation was to re-occur. Therefore, in the 1940's Keynes economic theory was adopted . This theory was premised on that when bad times came, the government of the day would spend surplus monies, and borrow money to maintain economic stability, and hopefully stop any threat of a revolution.

Now what we have seen is a re-introduction of Keynesian economics with the advent of the GFC. The carbon tax is just another way of extracting money from the citizens of the country (to repay borrowings from the IMF) and sustain government. .By providing stimulus packages, insulation program etc, and employment through civil works, such as building infrastructure (schools program) , Tunnels, Roads, Hospitals (in Tasmania, for independant support) and other public works to maintain employment, thus allowing the economy to continue at some level of sustainability.

However, these are band aid solutions, as that they don't address the underlying fundamental issues of an economy. Because governments develop a mind set based on continued taxation. I believe that this mindset can indeed lead to eventual revolution (which we are seeing at unprecedented rates in the Middle East currently).

I feel that the way forward is really quite simple. Our great country requires governmance reduction. With the technology super highway do we really need Local, State, and Federal political realms?. Do we need to continue to tax when short. Because at some point all the stuff we are digging out of the ground will be gone. Can you imagine how much tax revenue is being raised through the mining industry, mind blowing, but when its gone, which we all know will come, how are we going to replace this government revenue. Continue to sell all our major farming land to the Chinese?.

Therefore we need to be electing people to government who understand fiscal policy, people who seek to be more efficient with public funds, and understand the value of money. Because we now have the class of the working poor.

We need to fight this tax to the very end, otherwise we legitimise our power brokers to continue their unsustainable thought processes. How simple has it been for our Governments really, every time they are confronted with an issue they bring in a new tax. We deserve and expect that our Political Leadership obtain the ability to problem solve, not just pass another Tax Bill.

I wonder how different our poltical system of governance would be if Politicans could be charged with treason when they LIED. Should their income be based on performance. In the end there are many ways to improve the future of our country, but we need to speak up and tell our Politicans what to do not visa versa.

Anyway I have had my rant, but I am concerned that our current Government has little to no idea, and see Political Office as a game of snakes and ladders. As a socialist I want to see equity for all but this Labor Government is ineffective and dysfunctional. The carbon tax has come straight after the mining tax, therefore, revolution must surley be a consideration , as the masses are forming and are not happy. Cheers

[tab]

To all those cracking about labour and the Carbon Tax, just remember your XR6T costs 10% more to run cos of the coalition and the GST that 'was never going to be introduced'.

More lies. The price of fuel rose about 1.5 c/litre as a result of removing excise and adding GST. The price fluctuates 10 times that in a space of a week these days and that's considered normal.

As for the carbon tax, it will make allot of people allot of money and make two tenths fckall difference to emissions/global warming. It's all about keeping the greens and those with vested interests happy.

Why not just legislate against emission intensive industries? That would be the simplest but of course raise no money.

[dule]

Stop crying...

http://www.smh.com.au/business/economists-slam-abbotts-carbon-plans-20110713-1hd3d.html

According to the people that know what they are talking about your bellowed Abbott's plan is even worse.

[Corzza]

Mmmm we wont really know!!!

[dule]

More lies. The price of fuel rose about 1.5 c/litre as a result of removing excise and adding GST. The price fluctuates 10 times that in a space of a week these days and that's considered normal.

Don't know about you but it's added 10% to most things I spend money on. And it all adds up to a lot more than the average $10 a week carbon tax is supposed to cost, in the end it will probably end up costing $15 or $20 (as all government projects do) but still less than GST.

Now you all started defending another tax just because it was introduced by the libs.

[tab]

Yeah because economists can be trusted on everything can't they. GFC anyone?

Sorry dule but it's obvious you have a limited grasp on GST.

It cannot and did not just automatically push the price up a whole 10% across the board, I gave you a perfect example yet you ignored it. What more can I do to help you understand?

Edited 14/07/11 12:12 AM by tab

[dule]

GFC was caused by greed and banks borrowing money they didn't have to people who couldn't pay it back.

[dule]

I sad it pushed prices up on most things I spend money on.

- buying electronics

- Phone bill

- insurance

- alcohol

- mechanic costs

- go through your weekly shopping receipt and see how many things are GST exempt (3 quarters of f*ck all)

Was there a similar excise removed from any of these?

You can't tell me that GST doesn't increase cost by more than $10 a week.

Edited 14/07/11 12:19 AM by dule

[will-82]

We were never going to be effected by the GFC, we had money in the bank and because of our lending system we were as safe as houses.

But that didn't stop Rudd from handing out every cent we had plus more to people who never worked a day in their life.

[tab]

You've just reiterated my point about your limited knowledge. It's a value added tax that replaced many others and was initially supposed to be across the board and applied to everything but the retarded democrats got involved and tampered with it to make it the bastardised version it is today that excludes certain items.

One of the key taxes it replaced was a massively complicated wholesale sales tax that ranged from 12% to 45%.

For sure you pay more than $10 in GST a week but that's completely irrelevant. The only reason you notice it is because it's highly visible, before it came in you had all sorts of hidden taxes and excises that you would have no idea even existed when looking at you grocery docket each week.

When the GST was introduced if any business automatically increased their prices by 10% they were dragged over the coals, I know this because it was prevalent in my industry (hospitality) and many businesses got fined for it.

So for you to say that it now costs you 10% more for most things is a bit ridiculous.