Modified Ba Xr6T Vs Stock Fgxr6T

[kartman]

  On 28/12/2010 at 6:05 AM, Jake XR6T said:

12.3 @ 113 is very impressive for those mods! I assume that this is not on street tyres?

My assumption was that:

Stock BA XR6T has been run by the magazines at the quarter mile at approx 14.0sec (~210rwkw)

Stock FG XR6T has been run by the magazines at the quarter mile at approx 13.1sec (~235rwkw)

The FG has a smaller turbo and less lag, therefore the peak power does not tell the whole story

and it would get the quarter in around the same time as a 250rwkw BA - with the larger turbo.

Obviously, a 12.3 sec BA would destroy a stock FG XR6T.

That is on street tyres, drive there drive home, no ET's either just the daily drivers dropped to 22 psi. The difference is in the dyno figures, not the actual power, I use a DTS Pro Dyne that is not easily manipulated and is 100% accurate. I have trouble competing with some of the "figures" thrown around but our customers cars are fast at the track.

Off my dyno stock BF 210 rwkW Stock FG 235 rwkW

Edited 06/01/11 11:16 AM by kartman

[Buf-Phoon]

The figures you are quoting on the DTS seem there or there abouts, however auto or manual ?

That said "no" Dyno is 100% accurate so pack that away.I agree that the times are what matters.

I have had my various incarnations of the T6 motor on some of the best tuners in the country's Dynos.

This has led to variations of up to 40 rwkw , hub, chassis, Dyno Dynamics etc etc.Like for like

Best tune I've had is the lowest RWKW figure. sh*ts on everything some of the supposedly best

shops in the country and I have used most of them.

So to state that your figures are 100% correct is completely subjective.

Like every other chest beater.

I don't doubt you have fast cars in your stable, but? What hardware is used ? how close to the edge

is the tune ?

Lot of variables as with all tunes and dynos, I just wouldn't be putting my chin in the line of a nasty left cross stating that

you are 100% accurate when dozens of leading tuners can't claim the same

[kartman]

The manufacturer of the DTS dyno would dispute that his dyno is not 100% accurate. He has an open invitation to anyone that is happy to sign a confidentiality agreement to show the math and method used by them.

I did a power run today on a vehicle BA GT that made 280 rwkW on another well known tuners dyno and it made precisely 235.6 rwkW on mine. Its an uphill battle as a tuner when you have a dyno that produces accurate figures against those that don't.

[Buf-Phoon]

1 vote from 1 member= gospel, not likely. Sorry I'm a cynic.

That said one thing rings true. Take it to the track and prove it.

A Dyno is just a tuning tool

They laminate Dyno sheets for a reason

[HID XR]

  Quote

Take it to the track and prove it.

I think they did run it 12.3

  Quote

One of my customers with a similar configuration and numbers ran 12.3 @ 113 mph BA Auto, Ebay cooler, springs, injectors, tune. 246 rwkW on Dynamic Test Systems Pro Dyne using SAE- J1349

steve

[Bomber]

The dyno thing does become a wank fest. My tuner, High Torque Performance (Gold Coast) uses dyno dynamics. I was a bit flat when he told me mine made 228rwkw stock - thought I had a dud. It had only done 2800km however. He then he told me that they've never done an XRFG auto that's made 240 stock on their dyno, yet you get people everyday with their 'special' builds quoting 250+ When you look at Nizpro, Chiptorque, and others that quote 218 - 235rwkw, I think they're the ones with accurate dynos. My cousin also knows a 'bit' about this stuff (Lee from Melbourne Performance Centre) and says mine is making the average. People that think their car is making 20 - 30+ over this are kidding themselves. I proved it recently with a mates car. He was rather disapointed when his figure went south on an accurate dyno - cruel I know.

A well tuned BF will make more power than an FG - the smaller turbo ensures that. The FG over a sprint however will hold its own due to superior inlet manifold and other tweaks thus far less lag. Then go around some corners and bye bye BF - the FG chassis and suspension ensures that. Both are great cars. I wouldn't have crossed from the 'dark side' for a BF however - it just looks and feels too old by comparison in my view, but is a better option I think for those that want to heavily modify Cheers, Bomber.

Edited 07/01/11 11:18 AM by bomber

[kartman]

I have retuned a lot of cars from other shops and 2 from MPC and I can honestly say Lee is one of the better tuners around, unlike many others I have seen the driveability is atteneded to and their is rarely anything more to be acheived from more tuning.

On the other hand If I buy a $100 000 to $180 000 power and torque measuring tool I expect it to be accurate, if you get a machinist to grind a crank he dosen't say it's about 1 to 5 thou clearance on the bearing, that's as good as my micrometer is. It's 2011 they have precision equiptment that can engrave your name on a hair. All it is is accurate measurement of speed from a sensor and torque off a load cell combined with some calculations. I can see on a power run on my dyno if the vehicle pings, has a missfire, has valve float and other things. We are talking about thousands of samples per second from high end sensors. The only thing that upsets the accuracy is poor wheel balance and bent rims and alike as the harmonics can cause the sensors to read the vibrations at high speed, typically only over 200 kph.

[Bomber]

yep, Lee is a gun tuner and the race car stuff MPC turn out is art. He wouldn't truck his dyno up to tune my car at the V8's on the Gold Coast last year though - selfish *beep* I hear what your saying - dynos should all read the same, but they don't. I just get over people banging on that their car is somehow 'special' and it must have been the way they 'ran it in' that it makes 30, 40, or more rwkw than another with the same mods. Yes some are better builds than others but not that much. It's crap, as my mate found out. Funny though, he's hanging onto the other dyno sheet - can't blame him for that

[kartman]

I have run cars from AVO and Mikes Dyno, they both use DTS dynos and the figures come up the same as our DTS dyno. Unfortunatley there is no liscencing or governing body who do regulate Dyno's. My attitude is that if any of my customers wanted to take me to town about figures I know mine will stand up, I'm aware of it happening before and it will happen again.

[Jake F6]

Hi guys, thanks for the replies.

My questions weren't really about dyno rwkw but about which car would be quicker on the street. I am looking to upgrade from my modified BA MkII to a stock FG.

Surely someone on here has jumped from a mildly modified BA or BF into an FG?