Fg Falcon Quality?

[Iconic Bionic]

  craiginmackay said:

Reliability issues?

Can't say I have ever personally had an issue with reliability with a Ford. Sure I have had some quality control type things fixed under warranty but this happens with every brand of car at some point and these are nothing that threatens the actual reliability of the car usually.

I cant ever remember being let down ( as in left on the side of the road) by any Ford in 20 years of driving.

What in particular have you found that is so unreliable IB?

Often when I refer to reliability I do in fact mean quality issues and as mentioned they are different. Without going through all the issues I have not been left stranded and mechanically the engine and gearbox have given me no dramas whatsoever. Ongoing rattles, diff clunk and suspension creaks that can never be fixed and Ford assurances that they are fixed are my biggest complaint.

I.B.

[Craig.]

Thanks for clearing that up IC.

I agree with you regarding quality issues, although it does seem to vary from car to car, like many other makes.

I have always thought that these ( Fords) were as reliable as any car. The exception may be when they are modified and driven a lot harder than they were engineered to be. That comes down to a case of you pay you pay though.

My old man still drives around in his old EF Futura which he bought new. It has towed a van half way around Aus among other things and has over 300K on the odo with original motor and tranny. Pretty sure he hasn't been stuck on the side of the road in all that time.

that's a good run regardless of make, and I am not sure how well a lot more expensive 4 cyl cars would be going after 300K.

[Venom XR6]

  PAH said:

Deming introduced these techniques to the Japanese in the 1950's. Some (most?) of the Jap Car Co's have reduced variation to the extent that they can do things like drop any piston into any bore . . . and they fit!! Before that, pistons had to be matched to bores to avoid rattly engines.

PAH

Ford have only one grade of piston now, they had 3 about 8 years ago, so that's advancing all the time.

Fords are one of the most reliable vehicles on the market, although the fit and finish may not be up to some other vehicles. Very rarely will they leave you stranded on the side of the road. And they will take an absolute pounding on Australians roads for decade after decade. Most other vehicles, especially Korean ones will be junk after 10 years. The best thing about Falcons is their ruggedness and mechanical strength and durability. Just wait until these Chinese made cars will hit the market for around 10k. They will be throwaway after 2-3 years.

[Slymeat]

I am yet to have a single problem with any of my fords except my zephyr but hey that's 50 years old and still solid. My first XR6T was excellent and had 0 warranty fixes the G6ET is just awsume, nil problems to date my wife just got a Late model camira Wagon and I can feel the bloody thing flex and my 9 year told me it sqeaked alot go figure.

[rprodrive]

  dashturbo said:

Anyway I have already bored you to death but my personal opinion is that the latest Falcon is at least equal to the quality of any japanese vehicle ( much better than Toyotas particularly the Aurion and Camry )

I don't consider the Aurion and Camry japanese vehicles if they are made in Australia!

But seriously, if you think that the FG is even close to something like a proper Japanese car (ie made in Japan) - I think you have lost perspective by working at Ford.

[bunna]

  rprodrive said:

I don't consider the Aurion and Camry japanese vehicles if they are made in Australia!

But seriously, if you think that the FG is even close to something like a proper Japanese car (ie made in Japan) - I think you have lost perspective by working at Ford.

Define "made" - the aurion powertrain is imported, as are a great deal of the components of the two cars. Not sure either is completely designed here either.

As for the lack of perspective at Ford, that's a crock of sh*t - Ford do a massive amount of benchmarking against these other makes that you describe - proper, quantitative, statistical analysis. My point is, Ford are in a very good position to compare themselves to these other makes, moreso than any armchair experts and naysayers, and well they should be.

People forget the price they are paying for a Falcon. Ford could easily make a better quality car, with top grade parts in all areas. But who would pay 80k for a mid range falcon? Consumers must be realistic sometimes - I know we like to get the best value for our $, but c'mon! The falcon is best in its class, but comparing it to cars outside that class becomes increasingly unbalanced and irrelevant.

Edited 03/02/09 12:04 PM by bunna

[RHR]

Well said

[tmac450]

  bunna said:

Define "made" - the aurion powertrain is imported, as are a great deal of the components of the two cars. Not sure either is completely designed here either.

As for the lack of perspective at Ford, that's a crock of sh*t - Ford do a massive amount of benchmarking against these other makes that you describe - proper, quantitative, statistical analysis. My point is, Ford are in a very good position to compare themselves to these other makes, moreso than any armchair experts and naysayers, and well they should be.

People forget the price they are paying for a Falcon. Ford could easily make a better quality car, with top grade parts in all areas. But who would pay 80k for a mid range falcon? Consumers must be realistic sometimes - I know we like to get the best value for our $, but c'mon! The falcon is best in its class, but comparing it to cars outside that class becomes increasingly unbalanced and irrelevant.

I agree that the Fords are pretty reliable. My wife's Forester XT is crap, we'd never get a Subaru again, by old man's Passat is utter rubbish, ,y mum's Jeep is a rattle box. My T is the nicest to drive, most reliable car of the lot.

But, Ford can do all of the analysis they want, they do little to properly market themselves. Look at Holden, they have an appaling reliability record, yet the majority of buyers beleive they are more reliable than the Fords.

One of the biggest issues is Ford's (and their dealers) dismissive attitude towards customer claims, their snail' space reaction to repair work, their denial of a need to address their many management issues and appaling customer service. Expensive Daewoo used to have the same dismissive attitude, but have changed their tune over the last decade.

Pulling out the line of comparing dearer cars to the Falcon is utter gibberish. Once again, Ford has completely misread the market. Most quality comparisons I hear are with cheaper Japanese cars. It's Ford (and Holden) who continually try to compare their cars with the dearer Euros, telling customers you get Euro quality and refinement for Aussie prices. When someone complains, they then turn around and say you can't expect Euro quality at a budget price! Truth be told, Mercs and Beemers are German Fords and Holdens, and are no dearer on local soil than our locals.

As most people have illuded to, the majority of Ford's so called issues are down to public perception, Ford's management is only making matters worse. Come on Ford, my 4 year old could do a better PR/Marketing job than your current effort!

[bunna]

Don't worry, head rolled over the "fingers ad" debacle

I reckon Fords biggest issue is its dealers, whereas the marketing is starting to get smarter (its a big ball to roll).

FCSD are too arrogant when dealing with the dealers, and the prices they charge are ridiculous. The reins need to be pulled and Ford's aftermarket service needs to be regulated. Ford knows all too well about the problem they call the waterfall chart, which illustrates the drop off in people returning to dealers for service after the 3 year warranty is up. Dunno what they're gonna do about it, and its not my job, just my opinion

[ronburgundy]

Agreed that servicing costs at dealerships are absurd - but that's cos that's where they make their dough. I have clients that have car dealerships and their margins are almost non-existent; parts and labour is where they pick up the slack.

Speaking of service (and I use that term very loosely!) mine went in for the 3000 klm service and I asked them to fix the fuel gauge as it seems to be indicative of a 52 litre tank. I've only just looked at the bit of paper they gave me back and it said "could not find fault at this time". WTF??!! There's only one time the gauge IS right - when I've just filled it! How could they not find the fault?