Throttle Position & Cam Position Sensors

[Guest FatBAt]

Can anyone tell me if the Throttle Position & Cam Position Sensors are covered under warranty.

I was told by a Ford Service Manager that they are not. I am of the opinion that they are electronic, static sensors that fail, but not wear out.

Any correct advise would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

[senna_T]

Every part on your vehicle is covered under the Warranty. The only reason parts aren't covered is due to "wear and tear" and I've never seen a TPS "wear out"

Your car is tuned, so unless they know that it is making more power than standard you should be able to get them replaced under warranty if you can prove that they have died.

[Guest FatBAt]

Thanks senna_T. I trust your advise. It is actually my sons car which is a '03 Fairmont bog stock except for 20" rims.

I had a Ford diagnostic check done on the car whilst it was under (Form 4) warranty and the report stated...

"CODES=TPS SWITCH & CAM POSITION SENSOR - TO REPLACE BOTH & RECODE - $349"

The car is using excessive fuel (15.9 L/100) and they advised this is what the problem was. Another idiot there suggested this is normal.

When they found out that it was a warranty through another (private) dealer, Ford tell me these parts are not warrantable. The Service Manager says now that replacing these parts may NOT fix the fuel problem saying that it was just a suggestion. The wording certainly doesn't point to "a suggestion". He said that the Cam Position Sensor was an old type and was just showing up different on their diagnostic. He says now that there is nothing wrong with the sensors. That would have been a $349 loss if I trusted them.

We did replace the rims with the standard 16's just to see if it made a difference. None whatsoever. (My son drives like an old woman too which as a dad, I can sleep at night.)

senna_T....thanks again

[senna_T]

No problem, you may find that the fuel consumtion is a result of 20s plus low speed driving. If you put the 16s on take it for a few highway drives for a week or two, you should seed an improvement.

Glad your son has a level head on his shoulder, last thing we need is another young bloke ruining it for the rest of us!

Cheers,

Pat ( formerly young and stupid )

[Guest FatBAt]

We ran the 16's for about 4 weeks and had a trip to the Central Coast in that time. We did that just to humour the dealer. It didn't make any difference.

I also rang the NRMA tech department & Dept. of Fair Trading and they both said the same thing. Yeehah. Two independant and unbiased bodies telling me the same thing. The sensors are warrantable because they aren't changed at intervals. Only when they break down. The guy from the NRMA even explained to me how they work.

There's 2 stories from the Ford Service Manager when he was explaining to me how big of a problem it is to change wheel diameter.

He had a car that was jumping out of gear at 100kph...

The reason....it had 2 different brand tyres on the rear (same size, same rim, same width, same rolling diameter) I would believe this if one was a racing compound and the other a train wheel but come on.

Another car was shuddering at high speed

The Reason....it had slightly smaller wheels on the front than on the rear. I don't suppose he thought to check the balance of said front wheels.

I could smell the crap flowing from this guys mouth. It was quite funny to listen to...I almost felt a little embarrassed for him.

Cheers

[senna_T]

Wow, even making up stupid examples to dig himself deeper in the sh*t, that's desperate...

[XR06T]

time for a new dealer I think...

[RB30-POWER]

if the tps sensor or cam sensors were faulty, it would bring the engine warning lamp on.

if the tps fails, it has two sensors in one due to the drive by wire (it must constantly compare one to the other for fault tolerance and safety) nature of the car the car will go into limp mode and not rev/run rough but allow the car to to be moved off the road. it uses this sensor to determine the electric throttle motor position, any minor fault here and you will know it.

if either of the cam sensors fail (has 2, one for each camshaft), it will bring the engine light on, but still run ok, because it will use the other cam sensor, should not effect fuel economy much if at all because it wasn't until the later models such as BF that the vct cam actuation became independantly variable.

sounds like you have a bit of a problem child of a car to be honest.

my advise would be, make sure the car ecu has the latest firmware flashed into it, there may be a tech bulletin related to the issue, but surely ford should have checked this out when they inspected it?

otherwise, changing spark plugs and oxygen sensor can never do any harm and I would suggest these to anyone that is having problems related to economy, even if they seem ok.

could always be a mechanical energy loss issue associated with the gearbox that may not be locking up the torque convertor and causing bad economy or faulty convertor that is slipping due to incorrect transmission fluid, the transmission also has a internal fluid temp sensor that changes the shifting operation, if this sensor was reporting to the ecu that it was cold all the time and not locking the torque convertor up it will waste fuel and not set an engine light, because the reading is in spec, just reporting incorrect temp reading, these types of things are improbable, but never impossible either.

just trying to think out the box a little because it sounds you are running out of options.

[Guest FatBAt]

Thanks very much for the answer RB30...To think outside the box IS what's needed. You have given me a few more options to look at so I'll start with the cheaper ones 1st.

Thanks again.