F-cking Shooting, 20 People Dead, A Mile From My Office

[Telionis]

Hey, now that's quite offensive... nobody has ever accused me of promoting George Bush as a great leader. Quite to the contrary in fact. He's caused nearly irreprerable damage to the US and especially the stability of Iraq.

I already agreed with you that we were fools to invade Iraq and that our actions caused the chaos the Iraqis have to live with now. Chaos that makes the Iraqi people worse off now than they were under his dictatorship. If that's pro-Bush propaganda, I can't imagine what you actually expect me to say... what, that Saddam was a great and peaceful man that loved everyone and never hurt a fly?

[Phoon]

Dont worry about it mate, yes you have a dumb leader, but we have a leader that followed a dumb leader into Iraq. So what does that say about our politicians. I dont think anybody would say that Sadam was a nice guy, but in reality, the pollies thought they had to do something after 9/11 and because they couldnt find Bin Laden or didnt want to, (dont forget, it wasnt to many years ago that the U.S government supported sadam and the Bush family were in business with the Bin Laden family), they diverted everybodys attention away from him and went for an easy target and started the War on Terror which will never be won. Its just a shame that when governments make policy decisions, its countries population tends to be judged as all being in agreement which is generally not the case.

[Laner]

well said phoon

[Dagabond]

Telionis I have one bit of advice for ya mate dont start an arguement with Blonk you wont even remember what it was about in the firt place by the end of it.....

33 greaving families what a waste.

[Blonk]

That's f-cking garbage. Their civil conflict claims 1000 x more lives than American soldiers. Furthermore, except in a few very well publicized cases, our soldiers are fighting well armed enemies - not civilians. In fact, if those evil American teenagers left, there would be nothing but widespread genocide. I admit however that we are idiots for not realizing that it takes a rape-squad equipped evil dictator to keep these different groups living together without killing each other. Remove said evil dictator, and nothing stops the Sunnis and Shia from just trying to exterminate each other. We should have thought of that before taking Saddam out.

Hey, now that's quite offensive... nobody has ever accused me of promoting George Bush as a great leader. Quite to the contrary in fact. He's caused nearly irreprerable damage to the US and especially the stability of Iraq.

I already agreed with you that we were fools to invade Iraq and that our actions caused the chaos the Iraqis have to live with now. Chaos that makes the Iraqi people worse off now than they were under his dictatorship. If that's pro-Bush propaganda, I can't imagine what you actually expect me to say... what, that Saddam was a great and peaceful man that loved everyone and never hurt a fly?

I refer to the statements that the well armed enemies are just local countrymen mainly of a territory that is occupied by an unwanted and foriegn invader.

That some of these so called suicide attacks are just controlled assasinations attempts on Iraqi and Non Iraqi authorities, and that some of these are carried out by non domestic entities, one of those being the USA.

Reference to Dictator - Their leader may not have been elected, but neither was yours.

The widespread genocide would end as soon as Iraqi's (whether sunni or Shia) regained control of both their oil and finances. The US has been starving them now for over a decade, innocent people starving from US policy, before even Bushes time.

Anyway this thread was about loss of life that was close to you.

I just stated that it was lucky you are not in a country where those acttions you condemn, are condoned.

Saddam was a relatively peaceful man compared to an Israeli / American Prime Minister / President.

Edited 18/04/07 02:15 AM by Blonk

[Flukey]

RIP Liviu Librescu :(

I just found out that one of my favorite professors, Dr. Liviu Librescu, did in fact die. :( For some reason, I just had a feeling that he didn't go out peaceably. Honestly, even though he was 75+ and 5'4" tall, I just had a feeling he wasn't one of the people who got shot just sitting at their desks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liviu_Librescu

Turns out, when the gun shots erupted, he jumped up and told students to jump out the windows while he closed and held the door. As soon as the killer was done with the first classroom, he tried to break in to Dr. Librescu's class, but Dr. Librescu held fast. After giving up, then the killer just started shooting through the door and one of the bullets hit Dr. Librescu in the face. (He died on the way to the hospital). But every one of his students got out alive and purely because of the time he bought them. The other two classrooms neighboring that one suffered heavy casualties.

Man, he's a f-cking HERO!!! (Thank God my Dad wasn't in that position (to be a hero)... thank God).

There is a picture of the professor and 4 other murdered students on the front page of the newspaper today.

Edited 18/04/07 03:38 AM by Flukey

[veczar]

Not quite. Wal-mart does not sell anything but hunting weapons (2-shot shotgun, 3-4 shot bolt action deer rifle, etc). They certainly don't carry pistols. Only Federally Registered stores may sell firearms, and they must check the status of the buyer with the state police.

However, the killer was over 21 and a permanent resident of Virginia (though he was a foreign national); he had no prior legal problems or history of mental problems, so it was legal for him to buy a pistol. Nobody is allowed to have or carry a weapon onto campus, but obviously, that didn't stop him.

That's f-cking garbage. Their civil conflict claims 1000 x more lives than American soldiers. Furthermore, except in a few very well publicized cases, our soldiers are fighting well armed enemies - not civilians. In fact, if those evil American teenagers left, there would be nothing but widespread genocide. I admit however that we are idiots for not realizing that it takes a rape-squad equipped evil dictator to keep these different groups living together without killing each other. Remove said evil dictator, and nothing stops the Sunnis and Shia from just trying to exterminate each other. We should have thought of that before taking Saddam out.

I agree

[Telionis]

Update:

I'm sorry to say that I was wrong - Dr. Librescu actually saved all of his kids but one. After the killer shot Dr. Librescu through the door, he pushed his way in and shot the last student left in the room as they were climbing out the window (not sure if that student was male or female). Sorry about the error.

_____________________

Another Hero, Dr. Kevin Granata, RIP

This account, like the last one, is based on what I have heard from other ESM students and professors, there could be small errors with this report just like with Dr. L's account, but I'm confident that the basic idea is correct.

Dr. Granata's office was on the third floor, three or four doors down the hall from my Father's office. He was in that office when he heard the gunshots and screams, but instead of hiding under his desk, he went downstairs to see if he could do anything. Peeking out of the stairwell, he saw that the killer was in a classroom and not in the hallway. He went out and grabbed an injured person and helped (maybe dragged?) them back to the stairwell and up to the 3rd floor. Then he went down to floor two again, and again the killer was no where to be seen, so he grabbed the next person helped them to the 3rd floor. His third trip seemed the same, the killer was no where to be seen, so he went out, got someone and helped them limp to the stairs. Unfortunatly, this time killer caught a glimpse of Granata as the entered the stairwell. The killer ran after them, followed them into the stairwell, and shot Dr. Granata several times in the back. (I imagine the victim that Granata was helping was also killed). But from what I have heard, the few injured people he helped to the 3rd floor did in fact survive.

It should be noted that the killer was reported to have come back to make sure he finished his victims, (none of the classroom victims had less than 3 shots in them), so I imagine he would have returned to finish the wounded in the hallway. Therefore, it is reasonable to assume that Dr. Granata did in fact save those people; even if their initial wounds were non-fatal, the killer would have come back for them. Dr. Granata would have been perfectly safe in his office on the 3rd floor, he could have locked the door and hid until the cops came... instead he ran towards the screams and gunshots. IMHO, that makes him a hero, even if he failed... He is survived by a wife and three children, all under 15. :(

[Flukey]

It was a coward who did this. These murderers shound be ridiculed and humiliated so as not to encourage others.

These guys go to their graves seeing themselves as Martyrs.

[Fat-Tony]

Once an idiot, always an idiot, you would not be able to convince them otherwise that they are not martyrs, which is the sad part.