XRSEX EVO 9 SUPPORTER Member 556 Member For: 21y 8m 1d Location: NO CAPA EDIT REQUIRED HERE! Posted 07/08/06 04:45 AM Share Posted 07/08/06 04:45 AM that's why the tuner is the most important. Vince at V&E Rigoli Racing has had many cars such as Lancers and WRX's pass the EPA emmission tests at their inspection stations etc...←I've heard some really good things about V&E Rigoli and from owners of all types a modded cars sounds like he certainly knows his stuff,now all we need is for him to start tuning with the Edit as the NSW guys are busting for a good Edit tuner CYA JEFF PS:Joe change your sig you are in the 11's←Thanks for reminding me. Also I was going to save this until later and wait until he is set up but Vince has decided to tune the Capa edits and has contacted CAPA today and they will be setting him up in the next few weeks. For all those that have been waiting for a good tuner that I highly recommend, the time has come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawsy Wanabe mechanical engineer Donating Members 960 Member For: 20y 2m 12d Gender: Male Location: At the computer, obviously..... Posted 08/08/06 05:01 AM Share Posted 08/08/06 05:01 AM I'd like someone to post the actual figures (for the not so bright, *cough* G.......*cough* this means numbers from the datasheet) of how many of these so called 'load points' there are in the EMS and then someone to do the same for the factory computer, I think you'll be supprised. I'm not going to tell you which way either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guests Posted 08/08/06 06:12 AM Share Posted 08/08/06 06:12 AM I'd like someone to post the actual figures (for the not so bright, *cough* G.......*cough* this means numbers from the datasheet) of how many of these so called 'load points' there are in the EMS and then someone to do the same for the factory computer, I think you'll be supprised. I'm not going to tell you which way either ←lawsy the a3ya has 8x10=80 fuel loadpoints9x11=99 ign loadpointsems stinger 32x96=3072 loadpoints fuel and ign.as to data sheets get on the ems get on their site and download the software and play with it!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob82 Member 65 Member For: 19y 10d Posted 10/08/06 05:51 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 05:51 AM I'd like someone to post the actual figures (for the not so bright, *cough* G.......*cough* this means numbers from the datasheet) of how many of these so called 'load points' there are in the EMS and then someone to do the same for the factory computer, I think you'll be supprised. I'm not going to tell you which way either ←lawsy the a3ya has 8x10=80 fuel loadpoints9x11=99 ign loadpointsems stinger 32x96=3072 loadpoints fuel and ign.as to data sheets get on the ems get on their site and download the software and play with it!!!!←It needs that many points becasuse its interpolation is crap and its a DUMB system, meaning it has no thermodynamic model of the actual cylinder mass within the chamber - unlike the factory system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat-Tony Member 5,364 Member For: 18y 8m 9d Posted 10/08/06 06:25 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 06:25 AM Do the new EMS systems use a closed loop control? This would acount for a good number of load points that lack in the factory ecu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRSEX EVO 9 SUPPORTER Member 556 Member For: 21y 8m 1d Location: NO CAPA EDIT REQUIRED HERE! Posted 10/08/06 08:47 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 08:47 AM I'd like someone to post the actual figures (for the not so bright, *cough* G.......*cough* this means numbers from the datasheet) of how many of these so called 'load points' there are in the EMS and then someone to do the same for the factory computer, I think you'll be supprised. I'm not going to tell you which way either ←lawsy the a3ya has 8x10=80 fuel loadpoints9x11=99 ign loadpointsems stinger 32x96=3072 loadpoints fuel and ign.as to data sheets get on the ems get on their site and download the software and play with it!!!!←It needs that many points becasuse its interpolation is crap and its a DUMB system, meaning it has no thermodynamic model of the actual cylinder mass within the chamber - unlike the factory system.←You obviously dont know what your talking about and never had the experience of an EMS ECU. Try before you comment, KEYBOARD WARRIOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob82 Member 65 Member For: 19y 10d Posted 10/08/06 09:44 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 09:44 AM (edited) I'd like someone to post the actual figures (for the not so bright, *cough* G.......*cough* this means numbers from the datasheet) of how many of these so called 'load points' there are in the EMS and then someone to do the same for the factory computer, I think you'll be supprised. I'm not going to tell you which way either ←lawsy the a3ya has 8x10=80 fuel loadpoints9x11=99 ign loadpointsems stinger 32x96=3072 loadpoints fuel and ign.as to data sheets get on the ems get on their site and download the software and play with it!!!!←It needs that many points becasuse its interpolation is crap and its a DUMB system, meaning it has no thermodynamic model of the actual cylinder mass within the chamber - unlike the factory system.←You obviously dont know what your talking about and never had the experience of an EMS ECU. Try before you comment, KEYBOARD WARRIOR. ←I've tuned a few EMS 2 on a skyline - not too bad. 1 on a V12 BMW in a GTO ferrari - not too bad eventually when the guy that makes them tells us that the rising edge is actually falling edge(not a bid deal - not) and 1 on a windsor in a hotrod. What your negelecting to understand is that the factory managment has PI/PID loops that control closed loop fueling, boost, idle and cam control. It also has a model of how much air is in the chamber at any moment in time. Its fueling is based on a linear approximation of fuel flow at each cam position - meaning that once you know the fuel equation you can change/tune the cam postions and you dont need to change the fueling. Hell I dont trust motec's cam control (at least not on subi's) let alone a company with not even half the budget or workforce. Not to mention the biggest advantage - knock sensor controlled igntion!!!! Biggest downfall to the Flash - no live tuning. Edited 10/08/06 09:47 AM by rob82 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guests Posted 10/08/06 10:14 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 10:14 AM Do the new EMS systems use a closed loop control? This would acount for a good number of load points that lack in the factory ecu←yes it does!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guests Posted 10/08/06 10:25 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 10:25 AM It needs that many points becasuse its interpolation is crap dw....and your in the know?and its a DUMB system,dw....it has closed loopmeaning it has no thermodynamic model of the actual cylinder mass within the chamber dw....and it needs this why?- unlike the factory system.dw.... ever herd of the kiss theory? sometimes the simple things in life are often the best!!!!!← Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guests Posted 10/08/06 10:39 AM Share Posted 10/08/06 10:39 AM What your negelecting to understand is that the factory managment has PI/PID loops that control closed loop fueling, boost, idle and cam control.dw....ems can do these as per ba other than throttle controlIt also has a model of how much air is in the chamber at any moment in time. Its fueling is based on a linear approximation of fuel flow at each cam position - meaning that once you know the fuel equation you can change/tune the cam postions and you dont need to change the fueling.dw....this again is load sensing of choice!!! as to aproximations don't you really mean guesstimations????Hell I dont trust motec's cam control (at least not on subi's) let alone a company with not even half the budget or workforce.dw....we finally agree on somethingNot to mention the biggest advantage - knock sensor controlled igntion!!!! dw.... definately a function that once perfected will be good even sct inthe training manual state that it doe not function corectly!!!!!Biggest downfall to the Flash - no live tuning.dw....amen←rob you seem clued up on a lot maybe we should chat call me 0422 452 007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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