A Question For The Experienced

[JimmyXR6T04]

hey guys,

just a quick question for the experienced. I currently have a custom tuned edit with CAI. I want to upgrade my intercooler, mainly for looks right now, but down the track I plan on getting a better clutch and then doing the injectors and exhaust.

My question is, if I get a bigger cooler will I need a re-tune? I was under the impression that if I got a bigger cooler then it would just be like driving on a colder day, so therefore the edit would adjust the ecu??

Unfortunately I dont have the coin to do it all at once now! So step by step!

Any help would be appreciated! Cheers!

[blueboost]

Hi, any new mods, you should get it checked. but is you have a boost gauge, and it does not run any higher boost, you should be right.

[JimmyXR6T04]

cheers. I planned on putting it on the dyno once the intercooler was on, just to make sure afrs, boost and everything else was running within a safe margin.

[blueboost]

that is best, if you are running the standed pipework, it should be all sweet.

[JimmyXR6T04]

so the car shouldnt run lean? would having colder air (especially in winter) mean that more oxygen being sucked through could create an imbalance in the car? Will the edit or ecu adjust for the cooler air and allow variance? the last thing I want is to have the car start pinging!

I have been advised by my tuner to get injectors before cooler, so maybe I'll do that. But if I can safely get away with doing the intercooler first without needing a tune, then I can do injectors and tune at a later date, and save money.

surely there must be some people out there that have gone a similar way??

[Ninka]

  blueboost said:

Hi, any new mods, you should get it checked. but is you have a boost gauge, and it does not run any higher boost, you should be right.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry to disagree

At same boost, cooler air will have greater volumetric capacity, and you run the risk of leaning out.

I fitted an ASE intercooler with custom edit program, and my afr's went from 12.0 to 13.4, so obviously a significant change.

Get it checked out just to be safe

[dingah2]

Hi Jimmy:

Please don't start the usual crapshoot here folks but noting that you are already running 250WKW on standard injectors my strict advice would be to avoid an I/c until you have the larger injectors for the reasons detailed above. Regardless of the tuning doctrine being followed you are potentially (note I said potentially) close to the edge of disaster and an I/c could well taking you closer still. Get an independant dyno assessment and always have any mods dynoed before running. Some of us have seen some pretty extraordinary examples of 'ok' tunes in recent days, assessed as ok by some and completely condemmed by others.

Take care mate,

Dingah

[JimmyXR6T04]

cheers for the replies guys. the 250 I have at the moment is slightly questionable, as the dyno appeared to be rather "happy". I'm guessing its more around the 240rwkw mark, but I intend to take it to DTS (where I had my original dyno run when the car was standard) and do a run before and after the IC.

My problem is that Simon (extreme f6) lives on the other side of the country, so tuning and re-tuning or fixing slight problems will be one heck of a pain in the neck! Its for that reason I was going to try and do the IC, and then later I would most likely make a trip to melbourne to meet up with Chris (who worked for Simon on his canberra trip) to get it all sorted properly.

Maybe I'll hold off on he IC for now!

I was sort of just hoping that the ecu would detect cooler air and therefore make adjustments to suit. Sort of like driving on a -5 degree night in canberra!!

whatever I decide to do, I will keep you guys posted and post my experiences! Maybe I'll try the IC, get it dyno'd and see how it goes, if it appears to be unsafe or I have advice it may become unsafe I will return the stock IC till I get the injectors and make the trip to melbourne!

If anyone else has any thoughts, opinions or experiences with this sort of set up feel free to post up your comments!! the more info I get, the better judgement I can make.

[cobrav8]

I dont think it is the temp of the air intake that is the issue, it is the change in pressure drop as a result of putting a more efficient cooler in than the standard one? ie. with the new cooler you may make more boost without any other changes.

[gogo]

A couple of points...

A larger intercooler will be able to effectively cool a larger volume of hot gas passing though it to the engine intake. This will equate to cooler inlet temperatures at SUSTAINED high flow rates. How sustained will depend on the rate of flow. In otherwords a larger intercooler should provide more consistant air temperature to the intake across a range of duties and air flows. Actual air temperature will always be dependant on outside air temperature (ignoring water sprays). At the power levels you are running, I would not expect the differences to be too significant.

The other consideration is what changes are made to the connecting pipework for an exchange intercooler. This has the potential make at least as much or more difference to the overall pressure loss through the induction system at high flow rates as the intercooler (as per cobrav8's comments).

Both lower induction temperature and high effective pressure at engine inlet (for the same work across the turbo) will result in higher air density as inlet. This will impact on air fuel ratios.

I would discuss the option you are considering with your tuner - but I agree with cobra and would expect the largest concern would be the change in the loss through the induction system delivering higher intake pressure. If changing the intercooler only, and no plumbing, it may well be that you will not have any problems at the power you are making, however this will limit the benefit that can be acieved with better plumbing when you move to make more power unless this can be changed at that time!

Good Luck!

Ben.