Big Power. What Are The Cons For Over 300rwkw

[Geeseman]

Good question CDM.

There is no really solid answer at this time. Both aps and nizpro do recommend that they are done at around 330rwkw. This we can assume is based on experience with tuning so many cars now on the roads.

Still we have seen some cars run very big power with stock internals (C&V, Badxr6) with no problem. I think a lot lies with the build quality of these 'production line' engines. Some are good, and some are bad when it comes to running with big power ('Big Power' sounds cool, doesn't it?).

We've also heard of cars losing rods under that power as well. Recently one member stated that he lost his not long after fitting phase II, but he had really low kms. I would think that this failure would be due to a fault in the engine that is worsened to the point of failure by the extra power running through it, due to the fact that the engine was so young and that there are so many phase II power level cars out there with no problems. Given this, if you mod it's probably best to ensure you have at least 5,000ks on the engine to ensure any factory faults with production of the engine are uncovered and are dealt with inside warranty.

An engine rebuild won't leave you with any change from $10K and to simply replace the bottom end with a stock engine would cost around $6K (being the two available options if you blow your engine) so the question is do you take out insurance on your part in the form of rebuilding the egine if you are going to play with power over or around 330rwkw?

Given the recommendations from the two biggest tuners in the country, I'd suggest that it you can afford it then rebuild the engine if you are going to sit at this power level (330rwkw or nearso). It will give you peace of mind for the most part and allow you to really give the engine a workout each time you drive rather than holding back knowing something 'may' happen.

Of course it's best to always ensure the engine is tuned properly to avoid detonation and that you always use good fuel in it. In sydney the fuel quality seems to vary a bit so keep an eye on it

[Geeseman]

Bit of an extension on the thread..... but... would be great if we could post up the auto repairers / builders worth their salt in Bris / Syd / Melb.... and what they have up their collective sleeves with new bits and ideas that make the 300rwkw barrier "not so much a worry" in terms of abliterating the innids of the box in question. Mine's just turning over 25Kk's, and has that noisy sad sound associated with ............ and yes - it's booked for an fluid change. Can hardly wait to see what's in it.....  

Good point Johnny.

Tony Domenello from Dural in sydney does auto recons with a 2800 stall converter. Isn't cheap but apparently it works well on an auto that has run 11's in sydney with 350rwkw. Call him on 96515803

He has just sourced gear parts to replace those in the box to allow higher power than 350 in the auto

Yarra Valley Auto in melbourne do a similar rebuild for 3K with a 2500 stall. Quiate a few members here have used that sollution with little to no trouble with 800nm of torque.

[cdm]

Thanks for the response Geeseman. In speaking with various popular tuners going beyond 330rwkw seems to be the point at which internal mods are required.

Something that still seems to be a grey area is exactly what people are doing beyond this point and how much is it costing. I am very interested to here peoples thoughts and experiences on the matter as it appears the options range from just doing the conrods (BA LPG engine being the cheapest option) to full engine rebuils costing 8-10k.

Thanks guys.

Chris.

[macka'sxr6t]

I think that I would just be doing the LP rod option. I would mainly be doing this for insurance reasons. I don't intend to build a 500 rwkw monster. It would be nice to know that I could safely tune the car to 400 rwkw if I wanted.

I would still be using the factory piston as they are pretty good and sealer better with less chance of oil consumption. Than forged pistons

macka

[TBO240]

I had an APS Phase II in my ute and the engine only lasted 2000kms. It is a 6 speed manual though. It actually threw a rod out of the side of the block. I also had to change the clutch. my ute only made 293rwkw. Now I have had the engine rebuilt or should I say a new engine with a set of rods and left the standard pistons. But the APS kit will be coming out.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

running stage 11 with almost stage 111 power ?

something is not right it had to be running excessive boost and leaned out to the max ,recipe for disaster....that's my 2 bob worth

[macka'sxr6t]

running stage 11 with almost stage 111 power ?

something is not right it had to be running excessive boost and leaned out to the max ,recipe for disaster....that's my 2 bob worth

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What boost are you running to acheive your power level.

Mate you really need to get away from the Factory crossover intake system. Very restrictive.

This will help lower boost level and still produce same power.

I have designed one for my shaker and design of another still using the factory Air box is in the pipe line.

macka

[TBO240]

Heat is the number one enemy of the auto fit a good trans cooler ,it wont matter how good you mod the auto it wont tolerate excessive heat so don’t stall it up over and over again let it cool down. You only have to stall it up once and will notice a rise in engine temp,………BEWARE.

[TBO240]

running stage 11 with almost stage 111 power ?

something is not right it had to be running excessive boost and leaned out to the max ,recipe for disaster....that's my 2 bob worth

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What boost are you running to acheive your power level.

Mate you really need to get away from the Factory crossover intake system. Very restrictive.

This will help lower boost level and still produce same power.

I have designed one for my shaker and design of another still using the factory Air box is in the pipe line.

macka

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That may be true but the fact is to get 297rwkw out of a APS stage11 kit you need to push the tune beyond the norm and in this case I think the tuner went to far…..BOOM

[macka'sxr6t]

Does the APS Phase 11 use the same injectors as Phase 111?

What was APS response? Did they make any comment? Or offer to help with rebuild.

macka

[TBO240]

Does the APS Phase 11 use the same injectors as Phase 111?

What was APS response?  Did they make any comment? Or offer to help with rebuild.

macka

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

some have stage 111 injectors some dont.