WSID - private track booking

[ktford]

  Geeseman said:

  xr6ikness said:

Drag racing is easy when your sitting in the grandstand with your dyno sheet :lol:

Yes, but at least I have a dyno sheet

Ouch.

Scotty

[geea]

  Geeseman said:

  xr6ikness said:

Drag racing is easy when your sitting in the grandstand with your dyno sheet :lol:

Yes, but at least I have a dyno sheet

Ok Steve, I've had enough. Myself and nodoubt other members have assisted you when asked. I personally have tried to help you as much as I can regarding the problems you were having with your injectors. Specifically the fact that you paid $1350 for them and thought that you ahd been ripped off, which you were. For no reason you have entered this thread and started defending APS and their products even when the arguement had nothing to do with you. There were resonable questions asked by White Tee regarding why one Phase II should be so much faster than all the rest. I tried to offer explanations for this and didn't critisize anyone. You decided to join in and support APS even though no one was attcking them. APS or Big Mick never saw fit to answer these questions. Big Mick, cause he probably never saw them and APS, Who knows why. You decided that it would be prudent to have a go at me and my methods. I can wear that no problem. Then you decide to have a go at Jeff, fair enough but keep it above the belt. What you said was not funny and was out of line. Jeff is a top bloke in a temporary situation and what you said was uncalled for.

Here it is straight. All the 1/4 times my car got at the drags after I had the injectors changed, had the benefit of a gutted cat. This mod cost nothing and was used to save me having to change valve springs, which I couldn't afford. If anyone asked me personally about my mods they were told this. Ask Scotty or JB to name 2.

Now to you.

WHY HAVE YOU CONTINUALLY LET APS GIVE IT TO YOU UP THE ARSE THEN STILL SUPPORT THEM UNCONDITIONALLY. TWICE THAT I KNOW OF, AND POSSIBLY MANY MORE I DONT, APS HAVE SCREWED YOU OVER. YET SOON AFTER YOU HAVE SUPPORTED THEM, USUALLY WHEN YOU ARE NOT INVOLVED IN THE DISCUSSION.

ITS SORT OF LIKE LETTING APS BUTT *beep* YOU WITH A PINEAPPLE THEN SAYING THANKS. WHATS WITH THIS.

WHAT SORT OF BEHIND THE SCENES DEALS HAVE YOU BEEN MAKING WITH APS TO CAUSE THE ABOUT FACE.

MAYBE YOU'D LIKE TO SHARE THIS WITH US ALL.

Geea.

[ktford]

  geea said:

  Geeseman said:

  xr6ikness said:

Drag racing is easy when your sitting in the grandstand with your dyno sheet :lol:

Yes, but at least I have a dyno sheet

Ok Steve, I've had enough. Myself and nodoubt other members have assisted you when asked. I personally have tried to help you as much as I can regarding the problems you were having with your injectors. Specifically the fact that you paid $1350 for them and thought that you ahd been ripped off, which you were. For no reason you have entered this thread and started defending APS and their products even when the arguement had nothing to do with you. There were resonable questions asked by White Tee regarding why one Phase II should be so much faster than all the rest. I tried to offer explanations for this and didn't critisize anyone. You decided to join in and support APS even though no one was attcking them. APS or Big Mick never saw fit to answer these questions. Big Mick, cause he probably never saw them and APS, Who knows why. You decided that it would be prudent to have a go at me and my methods. I can wear that no problem. Then you decide to have a go at Jeff, fair enough but keep it above the belt. What you said was not funny and was out of line. Jeff is a top bloke in a temporary situation and what you said was uncalled for.

Here it is straight. All the 1/4 times my car got at the drags after I had the injectors changed, had the benefit of a gutted cat. This mod cost nothing and was used to save me having to change valve springs, which I couldn't afford. If anyone asked me personally about my mods they were told this. Ask Scotty or JB to name 2.

Now to you.

WHY HAVE YOU CONTINUALLY LET APS GIVE IT TO YOU UP THE ARSE THEN STILL SUPPORT THEM UNCONDITIONALLY. TWICE THAT I KNOW OF, AND POSSIBLY MANY MORE I DONT, APS HAVE SCREWED YOU OVER. YET SOON AFTER YOU HAVE SUPPORTED THEM, USUALLY WHEN YOU ARE NOT INVOLVED IN THE DISCUSSION.

ITS SORT OF LIKE LETTING APS BUTT *beep* YOU WITH A PINEAPPLE THEN SAYING THANKS. WHATS WITH THIS.

WHAT SORT OF BEHIND THE SCENES DEALS HAVE YOU BEEN MAKING WITH APS TO CAUSE THE ABOUT FACE.

MAYBE YOU'D LIKE TO SHARE THIS WITH US ALL.

Geea.

Words of brilliance young man.

Scotty

[Blown BA]

  ktford said:

  geea said:

  Geeseman said:

  xr6ikness said:

Drag racing is easy when your sitting in the grandstand with your dyno sheet :lol:

Yes, but at least I have a dyno sheet

Ok Steve, I've had enough. Myself and nodoubt other members have assisted you when asked. I personally have tried to help you as much as I can regarding the problems you were having with your injectors. Specifically the fact that you paid $1350 for them and thought that you ahd been ripped off, which you were. For no reason you have entered this thread and started defending APS and their products even when the arguement had nothing to do with you. There were resonable questions asked by White Tee regarding why one Phase II should be so much faster than all the rest. I tried to offer explanations for this and didn't critisize anyone. You decided to join in and support APS even though no one was attcking them. APS or Big Mick never saw fit to answer these questions. Big Mick, cause he probably never saw them and APS, Who knows why. You decided that it would be prudent to have a go at me and my methods. I can wear that no problem. Then you decide to have a go at Jeff, fair enough but keep it above the belt. What you said was not funny and was out of line. Jeff is a top bloke in a temporary situation and what you said was uncalled for.

Here it is straight. All the 1/4 times my car got at the drags after I had the injectors changed, had the benefit of a gutted cat. This mod cost nothing and was used to save me having to change valve springs, which I couldn't afford. If anyone asked me personally about my mods they were told this. Ask Scotty or JB to name 2.

Now to you.

WHY HAVE YOU CONTINUALLY LET APS GIVE IT TO YOU UP THE ARSE THEN STILL SUPPORT THEM UNCONDITIONALLY. TWICE THAT I KNOW OF, AND POSSIBLY MANY MORE I DONT, APS HAVE SCREWED YOU OVER. YET SOON AFTER YOU HAVE SUPPORTED THEM, USUALLY WHEN YOU ARE NOT INVOLVED IN THE DISCUSSION.

ITS SORT OF LIKE LETTING APS BUTT *beep* YOU WITH A PINEAPPLE THEN SAYING THANKS. WHATS WITH THIS.

WHAT SORT OF BEHIND THE SCENES DEALS HAVE YOU BEEN MAKING WITH APS TO CAUSE THE ABOUT FACE.

MAYBE YOU'D LIKE TO SHARE THIS WITH US ALL.

Geea.

Words of brilliance young man.

Scotty

What can l say that Craig hasn't :lol:

[Cro]

  geea said:

WHAT SORT OF BEHIND THE SCENES DEALS HAVE YOU BEEN MAKING WITH APS TO CAUSE THE ABOUT FACE.

MAYBE YOU'D LIKE TO SHARE THIS WITH US ALL.

Geea.

This I'd love to know too....

[DBOSS]

  Geeseman said:

  xr6ikness said:

Drag racing is easy when your sitting in the grandstand with your dyno sheet :lol:

Yes, but at least I have a dyno sheet

TOUCHE :lol: :lol:

Craig I think Steve would have ment that in a sh*t stirring way as I need with my original comment

I think the less said about how good and bad other people's mods are and we just share our advantage's and disadvantage's that we have with different mods the friendlier the site will stay

C YA'S JEFF

[Geeseman]

  Quote

Ok Steve, I've had enough. Myself and no doubt other members have assisted you when asked. I personally have tried to help you as much as I can regarding the problems you were having with your injectors. Specifically the fact that you paid $1350 for them and thought that you and been ripped off, which you were.

Perhaps I paid too much for them, but that’s not to worry. My tuner looked after me with several other mods to ensure the overall cost was very competitive. A credit to him

On a side note, that was a private discussion with yourself and I assumed that it would stay that way.

  Quote

For no reason you have entered this thread and started defending APS and their products even when the argument had nothing to do with you.

I was in this thread before you were, and I actually attended the drag day.

  Quote

You decided to join in and support APS even though no one was attacking them.

Just how did I do this?

  Quote

You decided that it would be prudent to have a go at me and my methods.

I didn’t mention your name Craig, so I can't see how I was having a go at you.

  Quote

Then you decide to have a go at Jeff, fair enough but keep it above the belt. What you said was not funny and was out of line. Jeff is a top bloke in a temporary situation and what you said was uncalled for.

Jeff can wear it. He wrote the book on ‘How to put sh!t on Geeseman’. It’s quite hard to miss as his every 2nd post is a knock on me. I’ve also got more hair than him (well, just…). Obviously this has nothing to do with the real issue though…

  Quote

Here it is straight. All the 1/4 times my car got at the drags after I had the injectors changed, had the benefit of a gutted cat. This mod cost nothing and was used to save me having to change valve springs, which I couldn't afford.

That’s fine craig, but I didn’t mention your name. I simply said that perhaps more people mod their cars ‘unfairly’ as in the case of your suggestion that aps may be specially tuning Big Mick’s car. Now that you have brought it up, might I suggest that you change your list of previous mods on this forum to include the gutted cat. Considering that you have been critical of the price of aps gear in the past, especially in the light of your ‘cheaper mods’, it is important to let people know what they must do in order to obtain similar power figures to what you have. It’s important to let them know the implications of this given that you have provided all the rest of the information.

  Quote

WHY HAVE YOU CONTINUALLY LET APS GIVE IT TO YOU UP THE ARSE THEN STILL SUPPORT THEM UNCONDITIONALLY.

Craig, it would appear that you have an issue with APS. Why does it bother you if I am now happy with my car and the service that I have been provided? Yes, in the past I was upset with my treatment, but we smoothed things out and got over it. No point holding grudges as I want to enjoy my car and not get involved in ‘car mod wars’. My current tuner has helped me complete my current list of mods and has been very helpful and supportive in doing so. Understanding this I don’t see why I should be anything but pleased with my current situation.

If I’m appearing to be pro aps of late perhaps it’s because I’m just seeing too much anti-aps posts that I feel are totally out of line. You have to question people’s motives for bashing other products and that’s exactly what I am doing.

[ktford]

  Geeseman said:

If I’m appearing to be pro aps of late perhaps it’s because I’m just seeing too much anti-aps posts that I feel are totally out of line. You have to question people’s motives for bashing other products and that’s exactly what I am doing.

As well yo might, you've been the most critical toward APS of all. Is it your opinion that APS suck & Amberleys rule?

Scotty

[Geeseman]

  ktford said:

As well yo might, you've been the most critical toward APS of all. Is it your opinion that APS suck & Amberleys rule?

Scotty

The most critical? You have to be kidding....

I had an issue with service that was resolved, and I never said anything but good things about their hardware.

[geea]

Steve, Jules asked a simple question which I did my best to answer.

  Quote

Guys

I am keen to bench my T against other phase 2 APS kitted vehicles( not Hybrids).

What I want to establish is the variances/ relationship between RWKW, geography , day or night times, 60' times will also be of assistance.

Full street trim times only , no racing fuel , slicks , no race tunes etc = pure stock APS phase 2 only.

Personally I think my T goes OK , I have only run in warm humid conditions so the info is important from a statistical POV.

Reason I ask = I hear of low 12s in the other states with less RWKW and want to establish what it is I am/ my tuner doing wrong ........if anything or is it just ambient conditions.

For context I am pulling 2.09 60' and ET speed around 114 MPH delivering a flat 12.7 sec pass, so I am struggling with some of the times posted as my car is obviously making very good power and the 60' is not complete 

Look forward to your responses as something aint adding up for me

Thanks

WT

There are very few people here that could actually help answer that question besides APS employees, Big Mick and possibly Mark (100%). I did the best I could as one of the few others that might be able to offer a constructive imput.

I responded with this.

  Quote

The 60' would be part of it. Also the track condition too. If the track is sticky it will help both 60' and traction for the whole 1/4. I was running 12.2/12.3 with 115/116mph. This was with Boof. If the tune is conservative down low to protect the drive line this will give slower 60's and also slower times. Possibly compare dyno graphs and see if the power is coming on differently too. Maybe talk to Big Mick and see if he can get you a copy of his dyno graph to compare to your own. 

Or you could always bring it down to Melbourne and I'll get you some sub 12.5's. 

Jules responded by getting more to the point of what he was actually asking with this.

  Quote

Craig , that is absolutely want I to establish. Big MPH V 60' times.You cant tell me that with my current 60" time and the strong MPH that mathematically we are talking level playing field here.

This has to BS large.

What you are saying is that ambient condititions = 0.5 secs or , a 60' of 2.00 or better= o.5 sec terminal speed with a termnal ET of 12.2 secs best .

Do the math , I look forward to the replies of Big Mick et al 

I have the calulator at the ready , this will want to be good 

I responded with the following trying to assist Jules in answering his question.

  Quote

I think that Mick had a little less rwkw's than your car. Mick's 60' was about the same he rarely got under 2 (possibly once). Mick's mph was huge I think 118 or over and that's on street tyres. I think 100% was getting 119 on slicks with his phase III.

These all took place on the 21st September. Jules was getting no responses from the people that would know more about the situation. On the 22nd Sept he wrote this.

  Quote

smallest data base / spread sheet in history. I should be finished next year  Thanks to Craig for his thoughts 

Question is that with less RWKW and similar 60' how do you make such huge miles per hour and signifivcantly better times with less power  I stand by my original question, does not add up.

Could someone please explain to poor dumb ole WhiteTee how this is ?

At this point Jules was sounding a bit frustrated and no one was assisting him. I knew the question he was asking and knew that he was being subtle. So 2 days after he asked the original question, which to this stage only I had been trying to answer I wrote this.23rd Sept.

  Quote

Ok at the risk of possible warnings and other crap I'll get things moving here. 

What Jules wants to know is why does Big Micks car have better results than all the other Phase II's out there. Its a fair question too.

My theory is that APS give the car a special tune for drags and retune it for normal driving afterwards. I know that Mick had "special" petrol last time at Heathcote, Dean can confirm this too.

One of APS's marketing stratigies is to be the best at the track, which by the way is a good stratigy. To do this they had to consistantly be quicker than BOOF, this wasn't easy and special things needed to be done. First it was 100% and now its Big Mick, by the way both of these guys are top blokes. 100%'s ute couldn't beat me on street tyres even with the phase III so APS had Big Mick's sedan do it instead.

I just wonder what will hapen when I get my car back from Amberley with the Xede fitted and get in the 11's on street tyres. No doubt someone down here with an APS car will come out and try beat it.

This could all be a conspricy theory but I don't think so. Maybe Peter can add his thoughts? Why else would one Phase II be so much quicker than the rest with slower 60's and also have a MPH very like a good Phase III.

Maybe this will get deleted for being to true???

In this post I never crityisized APS or there products, I even complimented them and also Mick and Mark. I put this up in the hope that it would get an answer to Jules questions.

Jules responded with the following, confirming that I was helping him in his search for an answer to a question he has. At this point I'd like to add that Jules has an APS Phase II and is obviously happy with it. He just has something that he'd like answered.

  Quote

Craig , this is an interesting theory and with the addition of better ambient conditions thans WSID would certainly go a long way to answering the question.

Whether APS is behind it I guess only Peter can answer that, maybe Mick can shed some light? I am in no way wishing to have a go , just plain curious.

At the end of the day how each person gets their times is up to them.

Zap , how many variables/ constants do you need mate to pose the questions I have asked.

Virtually the same 60', less power , both street tyres , both autos, yet a huge MPH and over 1/2 sec quicker.Farking obvious there is something else.

BTW , Craig best of luck with your next run in Rumble , be great to see an 11 sec time

There are a few other posts inbetween but none that are critical of APS If you do some research I doubt that you will find any posts where I have critisized APS's products or results. There are a few threads, like the injector thread, where I have tried to get APS to come clean on certain issues. I have done this for the benefit of the forum community not myself. With the injectors I researched them a great deal and openly shared this with the forum to help people make the right decisions.

This is when you come in with this gem.

  Quote

A little birdie told me that other participants at the drags knock their cat out. If this is true then perhaps like Mic's secret tunes, it's also not reflective of what 'standard' mods should yeild in terms of performance.

This may or maynot have been aimed at me. Either way how was it constructive in helping Jules answer his question. It wasn't. What was the point of mentioning this what did you stand to gain besides a few more APS brownie points.

What I don't understand and nodoubt you wont enlighten us is this. You have been possibly the most vocally unhappy APS customer on the forum. When you were upgrading you had a few threads going about how unhappy you were and I know that you had Nizpro gear lined up. I appreciate that APS has rectified this situation and this is good. You then had the issue with the over priced injectors. Obviously this has been rectified aswell. I'm glad that you have gotten satisfaction and had all the issues sorted.

Why after all this do you still act as an APS liason officer. The thread that started all this never had APS critisized at all. It was only Jules wanting a few answers to questions that didn't add up for him.

Why youi felt the need to jump in and start blowing the APS trumpet only you will know. Are you aware that even after 6 pages APS still haven't offered Jules an answer, either here or in person.

Now before you pick this thread apart in that annoying way you have, why dont you go through my 1999 posts and find all the ones where I have critisized APS's products or results and compare them with the times you have and see which is the longer list.

Geea.